building a new PC

[Jo3_Pinneapples[CYM]]

ok i need a new GFXcard which means i'll more than likely need a new mobo

so its time to build a comp, as i dont want to buy an 'off the shelf' computer
this is where i need help

WHAT I WANT !

prosessor :- thinking of getting a AMD 64bit, but whats the best
mobo :- as the prosessor is the main desider in mobo choice what goes best with the AMD 64bit ( or a fast/good intel ) is it worth spending money on a board that has 5.1 or 7.1 sound built in or get a sound card
gfx card :- this i know can also have an effect on the mobo and is also the place where i would like to save money ( thinking of the new SLI cards, buy one for now and get another later on )
case :- i will be modding the case so dont worry to much about this, i have some ideas for a water cooled system
PSU :- am i better getting the highest wattage i can ?? or can you have to much?
storage :- is it better to have 1 big HDD or 2 smaller ones ? (one for games and one for other stuff??? )

if you can think of other things that i've not mentioned please add to the list

also i know i could build the computer but what then ? is it a case of plug it all together and boot up with the winXP disks in the drive? (somehow i dont think so)



so let me know what you think ?

[Dolko]

I have no idea about the comp-things mate..Im just glad your back :)
Give me a word mate..!!
Btw..You playing with us on sunday?4 pm?

[Bender (BBR)]

Get a sound card, the onboard shit uses up resources.

Regarding everything else, I would go for the best shit you can afford. When I built mine I used the second best components on the market as the top is normally a lot extra for a minor improvement, youre just paying the price for the best.

Get 1 big HDD, then you can always add another when you fill it with pron.

[TheFella]

']is it a case of plug it all together and boot up with the winXP disks in the drive? (somehow i dont think so)
Surprisingly it is pretty much that simple. First make sure she boots into BIOS, then make sure the BIOS settings are right. Then boot up from XP disc and install. Get GFX drivers installed, then Windows updates then you can get the latest drivers for everything else and voila. Not forgetting anti-virus and firewall.

[BulletMagnet]

Get 1 big HDD, then you can always add another when you fill it with pron.

:nono: No, you get a HDD specific for pron, not after you filled your HDD............amateurs ;)

[Zeph]

LMAO @ PornMagnet :D

[Jo3_Pinneapples[CYM]]

ok if i get 2 HDD's do i opt for RAID 0 or RAID 5 setup??

[-666- S8N]

']ok if i get 2 HDD's do i opt for RAID 0 or RAID 5 setup??


You can't Raid5 2 discs you need min 3discs . You can mirror 2 discs Raid1

[Afrodo]

Raid 5 is hot swap isn't it, no point in doing that in a home pc. raid 0 is pointless as long as you backup your system well.
I'd have XP installed on a single, very quick drive (WD Raptor) and two large HDD as storage in raid 1 or just on their own.
If you get a new mobo, make sure you go PCI express, even if u don't start off getting the best pci-e gfx card, cos then in the future u'll be able to get a much better card and it will still be compatable

[-666- S8N]

Raid 5 is hot swap isn't it, no point in doing that in a home pc. raid 0 is pointless as long as you backup your system well.
I'd have XP installed on a single, very quick drive (WD Raptor) and two large HDD as storage in raid 1 or just on their own.
If you get a new mobo, make sure you go PCI express, even if u don't start off getting the best pci-e gfx card, cos then in the future u'll be able to get a much better card and it will still be compatable


RAID5 isn't hot swap, thats down to the hardware of your machine and if it does that. RAID5 is fault tolerance, if 1 disk goes down you don't lose all your data, replace the drive and you are up and running again. Good if you have a lot of data.

Why PCI-e , AGP all the way, much better.

[ha0x]

AMD 3000+ 64Bit= cheap

and don't forget to cool your HDD's if you watching to much "things"

[Snader]

Just get enought cooling shit in you're PC
And uhm no beer cooling system !
Because my keyboard didn;t liked it very much

[Afrodo]

Why PCI-e , AGP all the way, much better.
Cos agp is on its way out.

[TheFella]

PCI-e all the way.

[Drake]

If you intend on going AGP then id recommend one of the nforce 3 ultra boards, the MSI K8N Neo2 Platinum is a good board. If you're going PCIX then the nforce 4 mobos are the thing as far as I am concerned. Go 939 pin tbh, you get higher fsb and the 754's cost almost as much.

Motherboard (amd 64 939pin) = MSI K8N Neo2 Platinum (nf3 ultra agp) or MSI K8N SLi Diamond NF4

Ram = as much as you can afford, for a setup like this 2 x 512mb Corsair XMS (Twin) or some Geil etc, depends on what you want to do with it, oc? leave at stock speed? etc.

CPU = best 939 pin 64 you can afford, or, get a cheap one and wait for the fx55's to come down :P (also try to go retail, warrenty etc, although some will argue its a waste of cash, but at least the cooler will get you along until you go water cooling).

Graphics, if you go agp then just go for the biggest card you can afford, because agp wont be here all that long and you wont be seeing many more high end cards anyway (well, maybe, who knows, remember old PCI?). Otherwise go for a reasonable pcix card like the 6600 etc and get another for SLI when you can afford it etc. (Still better off getting the best you can afford now, otherwise you'll be buy 2 good cards in the future).

HDD's... now thats a tough one, I'd say stay away from maxtor, I'v had 3 returns on one of my 120gb diamond max plus 9's, not the best. IBM (lololol) suck even more (at least the older ones did). For reliability stick go with western digital, the raptor is pure sex in a can.

Sound, tbfh I have no idea, I've used creative in the past, audigy etc, mostly its the drivers that annoy me with creative products. Anyone else recommend some good audio?

Now, on a rig like this you're going to want some mad pointing device, some beast mouse from hell, personally I use a Logitech MX510, good resolution, good feel. Its a corded mouse, much easier to look after, no worries of it going to sleep every few seconds and being sluggish or the needing to be charged etc, plus its lighter without batteries etc. Pick a decent high end mouse mat to go with your mouse, Ice Mat 2 Pro is good. This is all assuming you dont already have a good mouse etc, so if you already have, brill.

PSU = biggest baddest son-of-a-B£££AAAATCH you can get, the bigger the better, if you're going to be running 2 x 6600 PCIX in SLI with 2 hdd's and amd 64 + high end mobo + ram etc, id say a 550 watt would be perfect (is the water cooler powered seperate or from native 12v?).

[Jo3_Pinneapples[CYM]]

theres no way i'll get AGP
looking to get the new SLI cards for GFX
in theory you can use the RAID 5 setup on 2 HHD's
like afro said agp is all but dead, and 'do you remember the the pci slot?' ffs thats what i've got :(
the water cooler will be powered internaly ( hopefuly )

[Drake]

right, so you want to drain juice from the main system PSU to power the water cooler, yeah 550 watt tbh, id even look higher if possible. Reason I covered agp was for others who may be reading this for ideas. Any ideas on budget? otherwise this becomes a case of "how longs a piece of string", maybe you should hold a "best PC for sub $$$ budget" give us a figure and see who can source the best pc for that.

[Jo3_Pinneapples[CYM]]

atm no money but i will be spending around the £1000 mark when i get some money

[XerXoX]

I have just build a new pc ,with my brother djaxx

this is it-----> Athlon64 3500+64bit socket 939
asus abn_sli_Deluxe Motherboard s939 Nforce 4,4ddr133 r 6ca
HD : Maxtor 200 gb
GFX : XfX pcx/6600/ 256 rambit /tv out Pci express
Ram : Twinmos/M-tec/elixer/mosel/vdata ddr400 512MB
DVD-Rw : Pioneer internal dvd-r/+r/rw 16x (dvdr-109) dual layer

New flatscreen : e-Yama 17 tft (17ne1-s) silver tft monitor

I pay for this 1 ---> 1400 euro cheerzz

[Zeph]

LoL @ e-Yama, its Iiyama. lol :D

[TheFella]

"how longs a piece of string"
Twice the distance from the middle to the end. :D

[XerXoX]

LoL @ e-Yama, its Iiyama. lol :D

Not in belgium m8...

[Jo3_Pinneapples[CYM]]

spent a few hrs looking around for the system i want and i know i'll never be able to affored it so i'm thinking of a cheaper system for now

MOBO-- going for an ASUS SLI one
THE ONE AT THE TOP (http://www.overclockers.co.uk/acatalog/ASUS_Socket_939.html)

GFX CARD-- thinking of getting the geforce PCX6600 GT card, have a look at the link should i get the 1st card or the 3rd card on
THIS PAGE (http://www.overclockers.co.uk/acatalog/6600_GT.html)

PROCESSOR-- is it worth spending more money to get a AMD 64FX55, or save money and get the AMD 64 3000 ???
LOOK AT THE RANGE (http://www.overclockers.co.uk/acatalog/Socket_939_cpus.html)

MEMORY-- how do i know what memory to get ?????????

PSU-- can anyone recomend a good make/model ??? again another area where i get lost

OPTICAL DRIVES-- stupid question but can i just get a DVD+RW and use that to read/install CD/DVD's ???? ie. will it work as ROM?

HDD-- thinking of the Seagate Barracuda, any pros/cons ???
2x THE ONE AT THE BOTTOM (http://www.overclockers.co.uk/acatalog/Seagate2.html)

CASE-- last but not least
HAVE A LOOK (http://www.loonyasylum.net/forum/showthread.php?threadid=5832)

ATM this adds upto around £900 allowing for extra money for cables and stuff
i've not included money for OS and other software and only inclued 1 GFX card and £40 for optical drives


PS i know those links are all to the overclockers site but its a good place to have a look, i dont realy want posts saying 'take a look at this site its way UBER'.
by all means post links to items from other sites, but please give reasons why that product is better than the ones i've picked, and remember money IS AN ISSUE!!

[TheFella]

Have you included a RAM estimate in that £900?? As good RAM will prolly set you back £200.

[BulletMagnet]

deffo not worth spending that kind of money on the FX-55, well unless your rich of course, which you ain't.
I'm told that it isd far more economical to get the 3200+ one and then OC it, but if you do that your case of choice might struggle with the heat (read review I posted in your 'new case' thread).
Also when buying CPU, make sure it's the Winchester core, not the Newcastle one, see below for reasons

Hope this helps Jo3


Socket 939 Athlon 64 [Custom PC]
COMPANY: AMD
ISSUE: 17 DATE: Feb 05

Verdict: The Winchester core 3000+ is fast, cheap, runs cool and is incredibly overclockable, making it the ideal enthusiast's processor


Socket 939 is only about five months old, but already supports a big and ever-expanding family of Athlon 64 CPUs. The uber high-end and ever-so-desirable Socket 939 Athlon 64 FX processors are reviewed separately, so this page is dedicated to standard Socket 939 Athlon 64 models.

A whole page for one processor family might seem excessive, but Socket 939 Athlon 64 processors are AMD's primary focus right now, going head to head with the LGA775 Pentium 4e family. It's also the processor family that has undergone the most changes. This is because Socket 939 Athlon 64s can be based on one of three different cores: Clawhammer, Newcastle or Winchester. Clawhammer and Newcastle core processors are also made in Socket 754 format, but only with single-channel memory controllers. All Socket 939 processors have dual-channel memory controllers.

Other common features include support for Cool n Quiet (as long as you don't overclock), a downwards unlocked multiplier and AMD Enhanced Virus Protection as long as you have Windows XP Service Pack 2 installed. Cool n Quiet drops the multiplier of the CPU when it's idle, thus reducing how much heat the CPU produces. It can also switch off the CPU fan when the CPU is running in this slower state. As soon as you start running any applications Cool n Quiet will bring the CPU frequency back to normal.

The only Socket 939 Clawhammer chip is the 4000+, which runs at 2.4GHz and has 1MB of Level 2 cache. Shave £53 off the price of a 4000+ and you could buy a 3800+ which runs at the same frequency, but is based on the Newcastle core with 512KB of Level 2 cache. There's no denying that both of these chips are incredibly fast, but at more than £400 a shot they're not exactly cheap. Both the 3800+ and 4000+ outshine the best the Pentium 4e has to offer, and the 4000+ even sneaked past the ultra-expensive 3.46GHz Pentium 4 Extreme Edition.

Despite their lower PR ratings, the 3000+, 3200+ and 3500+ are the real stars of the Socket 939 show. These chips were first available based on the Newcastle core, but have been superseded over the past few weeks by models based on the Winchester core. The Winchester core doesn't add any new architectural features to the Athlon 64 family, so these three chips have the same 512KB of cache as the old Newcastle core models. What is different is how they are built. While all other Athlon 64 cores are made using a 130nm manufacturing process, Winchester cores are made using a 90nm process. This means that the transistors used in Winchester core Athlon 64s are smaller and more energy efficient. So not only is the core smaller, it can be run at a lower voltage, and produces far less waste energy. Older Athlon 64 cores ran at 1.55V but Winchester core chips only require 1.475V. To put AMD's claims to the test we ran a Newcastle core 3500+ in our test rig, and measured it running a full ten degrees hotter than the Winchester core 3500+. This means you could use a slower and quieter fan on the CPU HSF - yet another advantage over a sweaty old Pentium 4e.

The low-energy characteristics of the Winchester core also make these CPUs more easily overclockable than earlier Athlon 64 models. Just be aware that a lot of retailers still list Newcastle core Athlon 64 processors, so be extra careful when you're buying that you really are getting a Winchester core chip.

The Winchester core has the same memory and cache architecture as the Newcastle core, so the 3000+, 3200+ and 3500+ all perform just as well as their predecessors, which is very well indeed. In FPU-intensive applications such as 3D games, Socket 939 Athlon 64 is nigh on untouchable. For example, the 3500+ sped through the timedemo of Doom 3 at 1,280 x 1,024 with 2x AA and 2x AF at 68.5fps, while the extra £81 you'd have to spend on a 3.6GHz Pentium 4e would only buy you an additional 0.1fps, which is within the test's margin of error anyway.

Socket 939 Athlon 64 excels at almost every task except video encoding. Regardless of which encoder we use, we've always seen Athlon 64 lag behind Pentium 4e, partly because Hyper-Threading helps to improves the efficiency of Intel's processors.

In the last CPC CPU shootout there was a narrow but decisive gap in performance between Athlon 64 and Pentium 4e, with Pentium 4e edging slightly ahead. Up against highly overclockable and incredibly cool-running Winchester core Athlon 64 CPUs, Pentium 4e comes off looking decidedly crotchety and well past its sell-by date. The whole Socket 939 platform has several significant advantages over LGA775 too, including better security, SLI support and greater overclocking potential if you buy an nForce4 motherboard. As always, the decision is yours, but we know what we'll be spending our end-of-year bonus on.

[Jo3_Pinneapples[CYM]]

FELLA--
i've included around £100 for ram, but like i said i really dont know what ram to get
looking to get 1 stick of 512mb to start with, then at a later date get another stick

BULLETMAGNET
if you look at the link i posted i was thinking of the one at the top of the page, overclocking any part of the final rig is not my choice, really isnt a nive thing to do to any part inside the rig, is it really worth spending the extra to get the 3200?
also i dont think cooling the case will be a problem i have a few ideas about that

anyone know the Ghz of these 2 processors, without overclocking them?

[Lid]

Hey Jo its Lid[CYM]

About the RAM and the PSU u said u seem to get lost a good general rule is not to be cheap in these areas so make sure u buy a good brand.

Ive used cheap RAM in a previous computer and it sucked and 2 sticks of it went faulty :( ive now got Corsair RAM and would highly recommend it, its super fast and reliable and is good for overclocking if required.

Ive heard bad things about cheap power supplys as well, so i have the view that more Watts is not always best cos often a more expensive PSU at lower Watts will be a much better bet than a cheap high watt PSU.
(For example ebuyer sell thier own brand 500W PSU for 10.99 or something stupid like that, but i wouldnt even think bout using one of them u would be better off buying a lower watt branded PSU.)

I had lots of trouble finding the right PSU for me and went well out of my way to get it cos everything i found at the time was cheap. At the moment im using a levicom PSU and its excellent really good build quality and very stable. check out www.aria.co.uk they have lots there.
(A hint some1 told me is that a general rule is the heavier the PSU the better quality it is dont know how true that is though.)

Hope some of this information helps you

[happynoodleboy]

']ok i need a new GFXcard which means i'll more than likely need a new mobo

so its time to build a comp, as i dont want to buy an 'off the shelf' computer
this is where i need help

WHAT I WANT !

prosessor :- thinking of getting a AMD 64bit, but whats the best
mobo :- as the prosessor is the main desider in mobo choice what goes best with the AMD 64bit ( or a fast/good intel ) is it worth spending money on a board that has 5.1 or 7.1 sound built in or get a sound card
gfx card :- this i know can also have an effect on the mobo and is also the place where i would like to save money ( thinking of the new SLI cards, buy one for now and get another later on )
case :- i will be modding the case so dont worry to much about this, i have some ideas for a water cooled system
PSU :- am i better getting the highest wattage i can ?? or can you have to much?
storage :- is it better to have 1 big HDD or 2 smaller ones ? (one for games and one for other stuff??? )

if you can think of other things that i've not mentioned please add to the list

also i know i could build the computer but what then ? is it a case of plug it all together and boot up with the winXP disks in the drive? (somehow i dont think so)



so let me know what you think ?

Processor - AMD are best for gaming and generally cheaper than Intel
Mobo - I have an Asus AV8 and it rawks. onboard 7.1 does the job. You dont need a soundcard unless you are running a huge surround setup or using it to make music.
GFX - if you want the SLI option get a compatible mobo. Personally I think its a load of guff and am happy with one decent card. Many games arent written to take advantage of SLI. It could turn out to be a bried flash in the pan.
Case - Lian Li are great. I have an Antec p160 and although it aint particularly pretty it is a dream to work with and cool as ice.
PSU - get a good make - high wattage doesnt guarantee agood power supply across the board. A quality PSU is essential- particularly if you are considering SLI. Honestly- do NOT get a budget PSU.
Storage: I have a raptor for my steam and OS, everything else is on a big storage drive. Best to have this kind of setup- one small and fast for your OS and main apps, another big slow drive or two for your data.

RE building... most of it is slotting the shit in and sorting out the cables but the driver process is a pain and you need to learn how to set up the bios and all that. it's not hard but can seem daunting at first. The main thing is to check your fans and cooling work so you dont fry all the gear.

[DarkEntity]

as above basically, i got an athlon 64 3000+ but the newer winchester core (socket 939), and i bought an nforce4 ultra board, althouhg now i wish id gone SLI, as for gfx, id say GF6800GT, these are basically an underclocked 6800 ultra, they may be noisier than ATI, but u can use them in SLI,

as for cooling, im looking at gettin Coolriver Deluxe watercooling kit, it's a kit, £70, with blocks for CPU, Northbridge, and GPU, its not amazing, especially if you overclock, but it will allow some overclock, its near silent and its bloody cheap :P

but the 3000+ socket 939 is a good choice, these can go to about 3500+ speeds with the standard hsf i've heard, and the same with the 6800gt, overclock it to ultra speeds and it'll run just fine...

slightly OT - the core shutdown on my 6600gt is 127degrees! lol how much headroom for overclocking do i need ;) i guess id get artifacts well before then though

[{ScL}Driller]

the amd64 3000+ will goto 3ghz max and the 3200+ will fgoto 3.2ghz max but u will need so realy good cooling to do that

i have the amd64 3000+ running at 2.2ghz at moe with stander cooling it is still on 35C stock they run at 1.8ghz

[{ScL}Driller]

[suc]Driller']the amd64 3000+ socket 939 will goto 3ghz max and the 3200+ will fgoto 3.2ghz max but u will need some realy good cooling to do that

i have the amd64 3000+ socket 939 running at 2.2ghz at moe with standard cooling it is still on 35C stock they run at 1.8ghz